I see that all the time at clients and when delivering .net classes.

There is two sorts of developers, the ones that actuallu love what they do and hunger for information and hunger for building their apps the best they can. And then there is this other sort, the ones that do this for a living and as long as stuff works they are very satisfied.

To reach the second group you need to infuse them with passion, find their buttons and push them, often that is very hard to do.

I often describe theese two groups as artists and painters. Artists do what they can to make an excellent work, painters do what they can to cut corners to just get the job done.

Whenever I read a post like this I smile. I'd like to make a comment to the effect of "Welcome to the real world. Where real work gets done. Join us!" but I'm afraid it wouldn't come off as funny.

Fact is, this kind of development continues to this day. Sometimes in the guise of legacy support (e.g. "We need to add this new form to our old Classic ASP system.") sometimes because the developers don't want to learn anything new or start over. Sometimes, even when they move to a new framework, they continue to write code and architecture applications the same way they did in the old framework.

I started a job 3 months ago and one of my first tasks was "Set up a stable testing environment so the developers won't have to make changes directly to the production code while users are trying to use the application."?! I asked "Are you using any kind of SCM?" "What's SCM?" :(

Most developers don't care. They only do what they need to get done by 5. They don't read blogs, they don't read books, they are vacant stares when you talk to them. It wasn't the way back in the good old days but ever since VB and the Web boom/bust everyone and anyone was hired and we'll pay for it forever. It frequently pisses me off.

Bleh. Sam's comment indicates the sort of attitude that only re-inforces Ayende's 'echo chamber' comment. Either you are constantly reading blogs, books, etc. or you just don't care.

Nonsense. And there is nothing wrong with wanting to get done by 5 and you can do that and still care.

Not every developer can be excellent (and different people have different definitions of what constitutes 'excellence'), but that doesn't mean everyone who isn't excellent sucks.

Not to deny that there are sub-par developers, but please.

It has nothing to do with being excellent, smart or good at what you currently are doing, it has to do with attitude and what approach you use when facing a problem and utterly that comes down to interest.

How interested are you in your job.

The ones that are really interested more often then not read blogs, articles and books. Just like with any other interest you have in life, you get involved and informed,

Exactly, it's an attitude, a way you approach your work and your career. And thats what I meant jdn. There's nothing wrong with going home at 5 if you are kicking ass and getting things done. But what I see all over the place is a bad mediorce attitude about not caring, "I don't need to know this." And its not stirctly blogs but the people that I observe that give a shit tend to read blogs,, go to confernces, go to user groups, read books, etc.

Let me steal Patrik's analogy and twist it.

If I'm the head of a large construction project, say building a new hotel, I want a painter not an artist.

But I don't want painters who cut corners. I want professional, talented, kick-ass painters. But I still do not want some Monet wnnabes, however good they might be.

The vast majority of commercial programming is maintaining already existing code. It isn't implementing (to use an example) the latest and greatest thing I've heard at DevTeach, even if the latest and greatest thing from DevTeach is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Now, would it be a great thing if one could take the latest and greatest thing and apply it to already existing code? That depends on whether it is what is right for the business. And the 'sad' but true fact is that most times, it isn't.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that I don't disagree that there are people in all lines of work who settle for mediocrity (I'm working with a PM who said this week when I argued that a proposed design wasn't up to any remotely accepted standards, "You don't understand our group. We don't care about good design") and it can certainly be a real drag to have to work with people like that.

But it has nothing to do with being an active blog reader or whether one practices the current leading edge methodologies. Those are neither necessary nor sufficient conditions for being motivated, interested or caring.

And I decry the attitude where one sees artists and painters and denigrates the painters.

I blame Microsoft. They make us re-invent ourselves every couple of years. After a while, it gets old.

I say what I observe

it's not that reading loads of blogs and books makes you a good developer. it's that blog readership, user group membership and self-directed study are often found in close proximity to talent. it's not about cause and effect, it's about reliable indicators. and by jingo, are they ever reliable!